At first glance, Kenya Barris and Malcolm Gladwell may seem like an unlikely pairing. One is a Hollywood heavyweight, responsible for redefining modern Black storytelling with hit series like black-ish and #BlackAF. The other is a cerebral journalist, best known for dissecting the hidden forces that drive human behavior in bestsellers like Outliers and The Tipping Point. They come from different professional worlds, different mediums, even different rhythms of storytelling. Yet, their new Audible Original podcast, The Unusual Suspects, proves that they have far more in common than meets the eye. It’s a show about deep curiosity, unconventional success, and the unique paths that lead people to greatness. And at the heart of it all is their mutual admiration for each other.
An ardent fan of Gladwell’s work, Barris vividly recalls the first time he spotted the author in a restaurant. “Seeing a writer in public is like seeing a porn star,” the Los Angeles native jokes. “You see someone you’ve had this incredibly intimate relationship with through their work, and suddenly, there they are, just minding their business.” He didn’t let the moment pass. Barris approached Gladwell, introduced himself, and a conversation sparked a connection that would eventually lead to The Unusual Suspects.
The show, which premiered exclusively on Audible last month, is an unscripted interview series featuring candid conversations with some of the most successful figures across entertainment, sports, business, and politics. The guest lineup is as eclectic as it is impressive—WNBA icon Sue Bird, former Xerox CEO Ursula Burns, celebrated chef David Chang, music legend Dr. Dre, filmmaker Ava DuVernay, late-night host Jimmy Kimmel, and Maryland’s first Black governor, Wes Moore, among others. Through these discussions, Barris and Gladwell dissect the myriad ways people navigate their paths to success, offering insights that go beyond the usual tropes.
For Gladwell, the series is an extension of his lifelong fascination with the mechanics of excellence. “When I look at the body of interviews we did, everyone is incredibly successful, but they’re all so different,” he noted. “It’s a lovely illustration of how complex the story of success really is.”
On the other hand, the You People director sees himself more as a student in the process, learning as much from his co-host as he does from the guests. “Malcolm was definitely, as I say, ‘home-court advantage,’” he admitted. “His Revisionist History podcast has gotten me through long car trips and tough days. His voice, the way he understands the jazz and melody of storytelling—it was amazing to witness up close.”
The dynamic between the two hosts is what sets The Unusual Suspects apart from other interview series. Their contrasting backgrounds create a dialogue that is both insightful and refreshingly unscripted. Gladwell is methodical, a meticulous analyst who draws patterns and studies cause-and-effect. Barris, with his cinematic instincts, reads people in real-time, picking up on nuances that might otherwise go unnoticed. “Nobody reads people in a room better than Kenya,” Gladwell observed. “It’s the gift that all great comedians and storytellers have. He sees what others don’t.”
Barris, in turn, attributes his ability to connect with people to a simple, yet profound philosophy: every person has an incredible story. “Norman Lear had a sticker on his car that said, ‘Just another version of you,’” he shared. “That’s how I see people. Whether it’s a billionaire CEO or a chef who revolutionized the food industry, their journey is something we can all learn from.”
One of the most rewarding aspects of the series for both men was the chance to engage with people they might not have encountered otherwise. Barris credits Gladwell with introducing him to Burns, whom he now considers one of the most remarkable guests of the series. Conversely, he was able to bring in cultural icons like Dr. Dre, who might not have sat down with Gladwell on his own. “If he and I occupied exactly the same worlds, we’d be boring,” Gladwell said. “But the beauty of this partnership is that we don’t.”
As they reflect on the journey of creating The Unusual Suspects, both men recognize that the experience has left an impact on them as well. Barris describes it as “one of those things that can’t be taken away,” and hopes listeners walk away not just entertained, but inspired. Gladwell, ever the observer, sees it as a reminder that success isn’t a one-size-fits-all formula—it’s a mosaic of experiences, failures, and unexpected detours.
In the end, The Unusual Suspects isn’t just about the people they interview. It’s about the conversations that happen when two brilliant minds—each an expert in their own craft—come together with genuine curiosity. And if this first season is any indication, their collaboration is just getting started.